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Question of The Month...(August 2015)

carbinemike

carbinemike

Global Moderator
Staff member
Global Moderator
"Philanthropist"
Howdy,
This is a monthly series of questions topic for everyone to join in on the discussion. Some of the later questions may have a poll, and some will not. Don't be shy now, go ahead and post an answer.

With the headlines this week regarding Cecil the lion, do you support trophy sport hunting?
Additional consideration, do you feel trophy hunting orgs like P&Y, Buckmasters, etc. help hunting or hurt it?

Thanks goes to Ripjack13 and MikeD for this months topic.
 
Even though I will probably never go on safari in Africa, I don't know enough about modern day trophy hunting there to comment yes or no. Taking one of a herd of gazelle or something is certainly fine with me as long as it is a clean kill and meat utilized or donated.

If all is true about the baiting and what not, that is NOT hunting IMO, even with a bow. And the hunter should be flogged for not killing cleanly--40 hours to track him? :mad:

I do support hog hunting here in the US. And any hunting for that matter. As long as the hunter harvests and does not waste.
 
I don't support nor disapprove of hunting myself. I grew up hunting and in my teens really enjoyed it. As I've grown older I've really just lost the passion. Part of it is with the gain of age has come the loss of patience. I no longer desire those endless hours of investment scouting, stalking, sitting in a blind or in a stand. The larger part of it though is I no longer enjoy killing animals for sport. Yeah, I did it for years and I still have some impressive mounts on my walls. Ultimately though, I get more of a joy in seeing those beautiful majestic animals enjoy my property than I do from shooting them down. That said, I don't condemn anyone who does enjoy the thrill of the hunt. These days though I just prefer killing paper, steel and clay.
If a guy has $55k burning a hole in his pocket and wants to shoot an exotic animal, more power to him. If he breaks the law doing it, toss his ass in jail. I don't see how that should be a reflection on you, I, or the man on the moon for that matter. Look, the critics will always be critics. Do incidents like this give leftists fuel? Absolutely. But when you have an agenda or a narrative to cast, anything and everything is fuel. If it wasn't about this poor lion, it woulda' been about poor Bambi. If it wasn't about this dentist hunter, it'd be about how hunters trespass. If the trespass story doesn't generate enough hype then they will show you a video of a drunk redneck guttin' a deer in front of his trailer with Rachael Maddow giving the disparaging play by play critique. That's just how it works.
If it sounds like I'm defending a guy who broke the law, I'm not. He committed a crime, let the punishment be handed down, and be done with it. What I am saying though is it's silly that this is even a headline. Heaven forbid they tell you the real story of what's going on in this country and around the world. You know what's a more interesting story than a rich DB shooting a lion? How 'bout lets see those leaked Planned Parenthood videos on the evening news? Lets have an investigative report on Bohemian Grove that just happened last week. How bout how OPEC dropped the oil prices to bankrupt Russia and the new cold war that is resulting of current policy? But no, of course that'll never happen. But anything that can be in anyway spun into progressing the perception of anyone who owns a gun as cruel, lawless, racist, that's the topic du jour... "Thanks for that report Tom. And in tonight's broadcast, Caitlin Jenners anesthesiologist gives us an exclusive on how he was inspired by the artist formerly known as Bruce."
Did I digress to far off topic? LOL
 
Rich people are going to trophy hunt no matter what whether it is above board or not. This type of hunting done in Africa provides much needed money to fight poaching, provide for game preserves and feeds villages year round. The rules dictate that the meat be given to the locals, who use every bit of it. Everyone benefits except the animal. In many cases the animals hunted are already declared a nuisance to local villages and their livestock herds. Or there is an overpopulation of them in a given area and must be thinned a bit.

If Cecil was "lured" out of a protected area then the PH's involved will get their just dessert. They are licensed and responsible for any and all actions by the hunter. The hunter used poor judgment but that in and of itself is not illegal. The US Fish and Wildlife Dept have no say or bearing in this case and need to butt out.

I'm not a trophy hunter but I can see the allure of it. I believe in fair chase hunting, not the type where trophy animals are penned in so some schmuck can shoot them like fish in a barrel. But it will continue to happen despite public opinion.

As for BM, P&Y and BC, I think they provide a good service of recording trophy animals. It gives a traceable history of the animals that came before. But I also think they are run by close minded old curmudgeons that need to step down. It is a "good ol' boy" network that rewards those that kneel down before them and punishes those that don't.
 
Nobody really gives a crap in Africa about that lion.

It's a USA media hype.

As for hunting I apparently suck at it. Never killed anything yet.

But when I do it will be for meat first.

But as long as the species is plentiful I won't bad mouth trophy hunters. It's not my thing but it's been done for centuries.
 
Never been interested in trophy hunting, I did my fair share of fill the freezer deer hunting when I lived in Vermont, which also helped thin the herd, & it was always a one shot humane kill... The dentist was lucky that lion didn't come after him after he wounded it with a bow &arrow! For dangerous game like a lion I personally wouldn't use anything but a high-power rifle, 30-06/180 gr MINIMUM... But back to the question, NO is my Answer... As far as the organizations I don't feel either way about them...
 
PC Bullshit !!

I tired of liberal people tellin' me what or where I can ...hunt...eat...drink...wear...sit...stand...carry a gun...shoot...fly a flag...visit...touch...off road...read...and / or believe in !!!!!!!!!!

OK...!?

Thank you...

/rant
 
I don't support trophy sport hunting. As a shooter I see the point and the sport of it, but no, unless it's done for food or pest control I can't get behind hunting.
 
I think this is a two fold issue.

1. Hunting trophy animals. This is where P&Y, BuckMasters, etc come into play. I can appreciate and respect the amount of effort, time and dedication it takes to hunt and kill record animals. I have no issues with this if this is what you want to do. The problem I see with it is that as more and more of the TV shows, videos, etc all hype big trophy racks, etc that the shift of hunting is becoming less and less about the experience of the hunt and more and more about expensive bows, expensive arrows, expensive camo, expensive trail cams and the killing of a big animal.

To this end we are now seeing more and more game laws changing to accommodate this mentality. Antler restrictions, QDMA, are all a byproducts of this. Not everyone cares about shooting the biggest buck around, many hunters just enjoy the tradition and experience of hunting or are trying to fill the freezer. Why should their hunting be negatively impacted just because a small vocal group wants to kill big deer?

2. Paid trophy hunts. I admit I would love to be able to travel to Africa and hunt some exotic species. That said, I want to "hunt" them. There is a fine line in this case between paying for the trophy vs. paying for a hunt. I have lots of respect for those that sit in a tent by a water hole and wait for days on end in the sweltering heat in the off chance that the animal they want happens to come in for a drink. I have little respect for those that pay a "guide" to stage a hunt and lead them right to the target animal so they can mount it on a wall ans brag about what sportsman they are. These people give "hunters" a bad name and add fuel to the antis fire. I watched a video some time back of a guy killing a tiger that was chained to a tree in a park (an HBO show on poaching). Stuff like this happens when you have the money, the means and the lack of ethics to make it so.

I'm still not sure what to think on the whole lion issue. Without knowing much more about it, I think that the dentist should have educated himself a little more about the laws where he was hunting but the guide has to take some responsibility for this as well. I've been on one guided hunt. I'm my case all the guide did was give me a choice of stand locations and let me be pretty self sufficient. While I did know the hunting laws in the area, I did trust that the locations he had provided were legal and within the bounds of his designated area. I've also been on a few charter fishing boats where once again I relied on the captain to ensure we were in the proper waters and had not crossed state boundaries, etc. (fishing on great lakes)


I could seriously rant on this for page's but have tried to cut to the chase of my core thoughts.

Ultimately I support anyone's right to hunt the way they want as long as it is legal. I might not agree with it but I support it. Much like the fight for 2A rights if hunters are divided, we will fall, we need to stand together else we will lose what we have.
 
I was listening to a radio show where the host was venting (ridiculously) about the "killer" dentist. :rolleyes: He suggested the dentist go out there and kill the lion with his bare hands which would be utterly insane... :rolleyes:

I suppose a "fair" fight would be if a human could use his/her brain, opposable thumbs and tools (such as a sharp rock) to construct a primitive spear, dagger and/or bows/arrows. That would be the ultimate "hunt" keeping in mind that lions are social creatures and not often solitary hunters... :eek: ;)
 
MikeD said:
I might not agree with it but I support it. Much like the fight for 2A rights if hunters are divided, we will fall, we need to stand together else we will lose what we have.
Click to expand...
That's why I pull punches with hunters, to be honest. They are a huge block of fierce 2A supporters and God knows we need all the help we can muster. I'm also not the kind to try and change the world - a lot of worse things than hunting take place everywhere. But I want no part of it myself and therefore don't support it, especially not for trophies. How trophy hunting organizations operate is not something I'm familiar with at all so I have no opinion on that subject.
 
Can't comment on the associations within the trophy hunting community...don't know enough about them.

My thoughts on trophy hunting are more from a moral standpoint. I don't see the point of killing animals or anything else for "sport". To me, it is immoral. My belief is that hunting should be only for sustenance and for culling species that are becoming troublesome with over-population.

However, as echoed by others above...as long as trophy hunting is done humanely and legally I don't have a beef with those who choose to participate. You won't ever find me on a trophy hunt and you won't find me protesting it either.

I agree wholeheartedly with @SHOOTER13's sentiments...too many people want to tell the rest of us what we should or shouldn't be doing. Imposing their beliefs or morality on the rest of us. I believe trophy hunting is immoral...for me. Might not be for you. I won't stand in your way nor criticize you as long as you follow the accepted rules.

My 2 cents....
 
I am not a fan of trophy hunting. Mainly, I think it sheds a bad light on hunters, portraying all hunters as heartless killers, shooting for fun. I am all for hunting for food, defense, pest/varmint control to prevent crop damage or other damage. I think killing just to show off is poor sport. All my friends are hunters, and even if they mount a head they feed their family with the meat. The rest given to their dogs. They don't have a cavalier attitude about the killing part. It's about harvesting an animal for sustinance. The guys spending ridiculous amounts of money to kill an endangered species could take that same money and just buy a sports car, motorcycle, boat or small plane. I am ok with hunting 2 animals for pure sport however. I am ok with stalking "cougars" however. ;)
 
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