• Mossberg Owners is in the process of upgrading the software. Please bear with us while we transition to the new look and new upgraded software.

Mossberg 835 Ulti-Mag Pump Action Accumag Chokes

Took two shots with the Longbeard ammo, one with the Carlson's and one with the Truglo.

One clearly stands out above the other, but I'm off to church so pics and info later.
 
Alrighty, we're all about the pics so here we go! I didn't shoot 25 yards at all. What I wanted to see was pattern density at the longer ranges and go from there to find the limits so both shots this evening were from 40 yards.

First, I'll show you the Carlson's. This is the Longbeard choke with an exit diameter of .683 (constriction of .087) and Winchester LongbeardXR 3" 1200 fps 1-3/4 oz #5.
There are 105 pellets in a 10" circle at 40 yards. Less than the advertised 182 but again, they recommend #6s and this is still more than the average seen in the video I posted last night.

image.jpg

And then the Truglo choke paired with the same load but an exit diameter of .670 (constriction of .100) a full tenth of an inch. This choke is a card shooter.
138 pellets in 10" at 40 yards.

image.jpg

That's just shy of a 50% pattern in 10" with 33 more pellets than the Carlson's specialty choke designed for use with this load. The Carlson's pattern is still a good pattern. But the Truglo is better and deserves a chance if you're in the market. It continues to impress and while it patterned well with the DoubleX ammo, it's even better with the LongbeardXR which is living up to hype and exceeding expectation. Additionally, it's only a few dollars more than the DoubleX and I'd say its worth it if its a component in tighter patterns at longer ranges and I have side x side comparisons that say it is. It would have been the advantage needed when we had that Tom on the edge of the woods last season. He just wouldn't stick his neck out. He was just shy of 60 yards out and no way would I have taken the shot before had the opportunity presented itself but I would now. One last thought on that ammo; I found the gas seal about half way to the target and the shot cup about 16 yards from the target.

I may still try the #6s yet and see if I can close the gap further with the Carlson's.
 
Last edited:
The Hevishot Dead Coyote is on tap for tomorrow through the Carlson's coyote choke. While their site says its suitable for buckshot to T loads, the tube is designed for the Hevishot T. I wasn't interested in paying the cost of the Hevishot but to give the tube a fair shake, I feel it's the only way. They make a claim on their site but are vague about what loads are suitable, but if you talk to them, they are very specific in that they like THIS load followed by a couple other hard to find shells which I believe may even be discontinued.

I have some other thoughts on Carlson's constrictions I'll share tomorrow.
 
I'm pouring over a ton of information right now. Thanks to the world wide interwebz I've found early Hevishot info going back to 2007 I believe. There was, as there is now, quite a bit of confusion and misinformation, especially from manufacturers afraid to have the stuff run through their choke tubes for fear of damage. The stuff I'm finding was before the T load had been introduced and was little more than a whispering. Federal FliteControl was at that time being developed for law enforcement application. TruBall was on the horizon as well.

From what I've found, there has long existed a fine line between proper constriction for this load and too much constriction and blowing the pattern. To further complicate the experience, this line has been a moving target from gun to gun even within the same model. Amidst the info are tales of killing dogs at 68 yards or better and even reports of 100 yard shots and 100 yard patterns where pellets still tear all the way through 3/8" plywood. I'm not sure I can buy all of what's being sold in these cases, there is a serious dearth of photos for reference or comparison.

I had hypothesized Carlson's tubes were not constricted enough for the 835. I still feel this may be the case with the Longbeard. The Truglo is the bar to beat for turkey shot despite seeing a more than 100% percent improvement in pattern density through the Longbeard choke simply by switching loads. It still falls short of the Truglo by about 30 pellets. At 105 pellets in 10" it has only just matched what the Truglo had done with lesser ammo.

On to the Hevishot which I believe is a "tungsten matrix". In this case, I feel the Carlson's Dead Coyote choke is about right on at an exit diameter of .690 or a constriction of about 8 tenths of an inch. (it may be .084 or .085 depending on the source) I fired 3 rounds of the Hevishot Dead Coyote 3" 1-1/2 oz T 1300 fps, all at 40 yards. My first shot I pulled left, the second shot I was more careful and centered the shot over the target. The third shot I tried through the Longbeard choke which is 7 thousandths (.007) of an inch tighter in constriction. While the pattern was generally smaller in size, it was beginning to do some crazy stuff like form branches. (this was also the case with the Winchester Hi-Density Coyote B load) In comparison, the pattern with the Coyote tube was fairly symmetrical. (On a related note; Trulock has recently updated their site to include a mobile site. They too recommend a tube with an exit diameter of .690 for the 835 and predator loads with specific mention of both the loads I've highlighted here)

I found all 50 pellets on my target with a general over all diameter of about 34 to 36" at the widest point. 38 of the 50 pellets are within a 30" diameter for a 76% pattern. A 10" circle in the most dense part of the pattern (a little low and right of center) yields about 10 pellets.

The pics aren't great and I apologize.

image.jpg image.jpg

I'm not sure what it would take, but I'd like to see tighter than this if I were going to be comfortable with a longer shot at an animal. I'd really have to shoot this combination more to see how consistent this is. The logo on the box says "I didn't come this far to miss". This may be a legitimate 50 yard load and my patterns are still better than those had by the guy in the YouTube video I posted back a little ways. That guy spent $15 on three rounds to get 2 pellets on target at 70 yards and still claimed that could be a kill. Well sure, it could be. With practice I can make this pattern effective but for the price I still like the Winchester Coyote B. I've already had occasion to use it on the property but not on dogs. In each case, the critter stopped where it stood. One rolled back a couple feet. These were smaller than coyotes though. For general use, I'll keep the Winchester loads handy.

In closing, for this segment, I like the coyote tube from Carlson's. It patterns well with the pairing of recommended loads though I'd still prefer a more dense pattern with the expensive load that is the Hevishot. The couple times I've needed it, I was confident in the pattern density of the Winchester for smaller than coyote sized varmints. For larger, perhaps the Hevishot would be the way to go.
 
I haven't shared this one before. This is the 40 yard pattern of the Carlson's Coyote choke and Winchester XTended Range Hi-Density Coyote B. Its a 3" 1-3/8 oz load of 74 B pellets and is bismuth, I had previously thought a tungsten alloy and intend to contact Winchester at some point for clarification.

This 40 yard pattern had 73 of 74 pellets on target with just a few strays near the edge. I drew a 30" diameter circle around the densest part of the pattern, but in reality, most of the pattern is within 24". I counted 69 pellets in 30", I could have moved the circle up an inch and picked up another pellet but even so it's a 93% pattern at 40 yards. I trust this more than I do the Hevishot with this choke and the Winchester is half the cost. This is the load I've used around the house to dispatch critters thus far. The Hevishot leaves large gaps in the pattern, gaps enough to miss vital organs and leave an animal crippled.

Here are the pics, it's kinda difficult to get a decent shot of a 30" circle and still show detail.

image.jpg image.jpg
 
Here's something for thought;

I've spoken with Carlson's, Hevishot, and with Kicks. I've talked with the guy at Carlson's a few times now. I've shown him my patterns and explained that not only is the Winchester load more dense (it begins with more pellets), but the overall size of the pattern is smaller and that I was seeking some insight since the Coyote choke was developed for the Dead Coyote load. He suggested the choke may be too tight. So I spoke with a tech from Hevishot. He said their best patterns from the 835 were achieved with a .688 exit diameter and that their engineers worked with Carlson's to develope that choke. I know every gun is a little different and the characteristics from one to the next even of identical models can vary, sometimes dramatically. So I began wondering about coyote/predator choke from other makers and Kicks came to mind. So I contacted them as well. I asked about the exit diameters for the 835 of their two variations of the Howler choke, one for Hevishot, the other for lead buckshot. He said their Hevishot choke is a .745. Well thats quite a large difference from the .690 to .688 of Carlson's and others, but he said at 40 yards they get 25" patterns from the 835. My pattern was 34 or 36".

While there is little photo evidence for any of these chokes, there is one I found for the Kicks of a 50 yard pattern on a coyote sized and shaped target.

Who knows what's next but for now, I'll stick with the Winchester B load for the Carlson's Coyote. It's proving a decent combination.
 
I wanted Allison to shoot the 835 before the start of turkey season next weekend. We just did 25 yards so she could see POA vs POI.

She was very pleased with the target, this is the Truglo from RipJack with the Winchester Longbeard #5.

image.jpg

Like I said, she very pleased with the pattern and she loves shooting the gun. There's no point in counting pellets. There are holes on top of holes and if we can get a bead on a Tom within 50 yards we're in good shape.
 
Alright, so I've been crazy busy, it's just that time of year. I've been out to try calling in turkeys precisely once. But I've spent the little down time I've had (usually around 10 at night) for some research.

I've got a Kicks Howler enroute and the Carlson's Longbeard choke tube is on its way back to KS and is being exchanged for an extended ported turkey tube in .675 rather than the .683 of the Longbeard. The Longbeard has those 3 concentric rings on the inside as does the Truglo on loan from Mr. RipJack. We'll see however how this other choke does.

The Howler from Kicks is an exit diameter of .745. Sound HUMUNGO? It's quite large compared to the .690 of the Carlson's coyote choke. This is where the research comes in. I found complaints and issues with this very choke for the 835 going back 5 years or so. It's too tight for any buckshot and even for the load its designed for, the Hevishot Dead Coyote T. I have found where people have had the identical conversation with the Carlsons and another choke suggested with a diameter of .727. That's exactly what they said to me. Now, through other guns, people are experiencing very respectable patterns but certainly no where close to the claim of dense lethal patterns, (devestating downrange patterns is what I think the site says) to 70 yards. It's just not happening. But for the 835, it's way over choked. That said, I like the tube with the right load and have found evidence of the load I'm using being effective to around 40 yards which is among the patterns I've posted above.

So many of the heavier than lead loads have been discontinued and the Winchester Xtended Range Hi-Density B may be among them. There is an identical goose load on their site but it too may be discontinued. There has been a shift to steel shot for waterfowl in recent years leaving few manufacturers making the HTL stuff. Hevishot still does, but that stuff is still 4 and $5 a round. Federal makes something in a BB but its FliteControl which means a non ported tube. Which I may try yet. I have my sights (yes, a pun) on a choke from Colonial Choke and Tool. Those run about $35.

So enter the Howler. Chuck from Kicks firmly recommends the .745 for the HTL loads like the Dead Coyote and says their patterns are half the size of what I was getting through the Carlson's. Still no claim though of 70 yard kills.

Kicks has a very good return policy. They will continuously replace the choke until you are satisfied and have found a constriction that meets expectation. Right now, for varmints and predators, I'm just looking for a center dense pattern good to 40 yards, maybe a little more. I need more than 2 pellets on target at that range.

The Kicks will be here tomorrow. If time allows, I'll be doing some shooting. We have a playoff game to be at right in the middle of the day, meanwhile, I'm supposed to fix my sons car and change the oil in my wife's. All work and no play...

The Carlson's tube should be here by the end of next week I hope.
 
Kicks policy is outstanding! That is great to hear that they do that.
 
@ripjack13 Ive heard they'll even cut a choke to a particular diameter if need be. I've not tested that yet though.

I also need to add that Kicks plays it safe on constrictions. Meaning they recommend choke that are possibly more open than necessary. They do this to cover themselves. If you overload a choke and blow a barrel, it won't be because they told you it would be ok to run a particular load through too tight a choke. Given that info, the .745 may be to open. If it doesn't work out, I'm going to step down and find something to tighten up the B load I like. I think.
 
The Howler showed up today and I was able to shoot several targets. I'm not impressed at this point. I don't have something I can rely on.

Howler/Hevishot Dead Coyote 3" T, 50 pellets
3-5 hits in 6"
8-12 hits in 10"

Howler/Winchester 3" Hi-Density Coyote B, 80 pellets
5-7 hits in 6"
11-18 hits in 10"

I'm thinking that the choke can definitely tighten up, just means sending it back and waiting for another. I just sent back a Carlson's Longbeard choke too and waiting for their ported turkey choke.

To me, that's not enough to be reliable. The big picture on those patterns is that they aren't even altogether circular or evenly dispersed. At least with the Carlson's coyote choke, the big pattern with that Hevishot was very even coverage, though there were only 3 hits anywhere around POA. I'm not looking for saturation at 40 yards like a turkey load and choke, but I am measuring performance in a similar manner given this isn't wing shooting. Like patterning for turkey combinations, I def need something more dense than what I'm getting. 10-12 pellets can kill a dog sized predator, but I'd feel better and more confident with the shot if I can double that count.

I'm not the least bit excited with the Howler choke and I think the exit diameter needs to be stepped down to .725 to .710. I'll contact Kicks (Chuck) by email tomorrow and see what he says. He's usually quick to respond on weekdays. I'll update as I'm able.
 
Man...I applaud your determination Brad. How long till a new one comes back? Couple weeks?
 
I think a couple weeks is a safe bet. I'll send it USPS priority, but I can't get to the post office till Friday probably. They'll have it the following Monday-Tuesday. They ship two day priority and that puts us at two weeks. Maybe a day or two more. It sucks.

I'm not going to focus my efforts on the Hevishot Dead Coyote. The name alone is nearly a foul word. That and it costs more than twice as much as the Winchester HTL. So I need the choke tight enough for what is essentially a waterfowl load. There is enough evidence of the heavy B being more than effective as long as you can reliably put pellets on target. And honestly, a coyote gun isn't its primary purpose. Though, it may be used for that purpose and I'd really like to be confident in it.
 
I've talked with Chuck at Kicks.

He initially recommended the BuckKicker Full, but that's only .005 tighter than the Howler H (Hevishot) I have now. He said the BuckKicker XFull and Howler L (lead) are the same at .720, so I'm going with that. I think the Howler L is out of stock so I'll be getting the BuckKicker XFull.

The exit diameter of .745 = a constriction of .030 for the 835.
The one I'll be getting back at .720 = a constriction of .055.

I haven't added any photos because I just don't think it's worth it. The pattern is so uneven and wide, it's every bit of 50" between the outer most pellets. There is no pattern, just pellets here and there sometimes hanging out together.

I almost expect the BuckKicker XFull .720 to be too wide as well. While bothe Carlson's and Trulock suggest the .690 for these loads (which was close but too tight), my experience is leaning closer to .700 to .710.
 
Last edited:
I'm also trying to score some Federal Vital Shok 3" plated 4 buckshot to try. It's 41 pellets and little more than a dollar a round. I like the 70 to 80 pellets of the heavy B load, it's about $2 per round and it's been discontinued so I don't know how long till stock runs dry.
 
Thats cool if you get some. But wouldnt it be better to shoot for getting ammo that is not discontinued and is in regular supply? Stock up on that and pair up the choke with that load.
 
Thats cool if you get some. But wouldnt it be better to shoot for getting ammo that is not discontinued and is in regular supply? Stock up on that and pair up the choke with that load.

Yep, I very much agree. When I have the new Kicks choke, I'll at least hang on to it till I have some of the 4 buck to try. The BuckKicker XFull and the Howler L are the chokes they recommend for that load. The 4 buck isn't expensive, but I have to find it first.
 
I want to share what I've learned about "wad stripping" chokes.

Pattern Master uses "nubs" internally, other makers rely on porting. Kicks has very aggressive porting which strips the wad away from the shot. I believe the chokes with the internal concentric rings work the same way. The porting in chokes is the reason FliteControl doesn't work.

I was initially skeptical. Why strip the wad away prematurely? I thought the wad was there to keep everything together as long as possible. However, the wad can blow through the shot shortly after leaving the muzzle ruining the pattern. So by slowing the wad with nubs, concentric rings, porting, or by some other means, the shot isn't disrupted and the shot string or column is left in tact.

I don't have a non ported choke to compare this to except to say that FliteControl is absolutely and completely useless through ported tubes. There is/are non ported tubes I'd like to try someday however.
 
Back
Top