Vegas Shooting!
- Thread starter MikeD
- Start date
Why did the Sheriff announce the intended move by SWAT (going to the North Nevada home) before SWAT moved on the house? Seems like he was giving up vital strategic info.
Rico, I merged this here....
In some of the footage, especially the body cam footage, I heard 2 distinct weapons being fired simultaneously.
Further, if a bump stock had been in use at the time, would have made it impossible for a single shooter to be firing 2 weapons at the same time because bump fire requires both hands to be used at the same time and eliminates the possibility that a single shooter was shooting with one weapon in each hand.
It's very clear and obvious.
It wasn't an echo (echo's repeat exactly what is there). Echo's don't change the number of shots being fired. The video shows two distinct rates of fire and weapons being used.
I don't care what the official explanation is.
Further, there are videos that have been posted by former marines with combat experience that were in the "kill box" that said they have no doubts of two.
Aside from the body cam footage, listen to 4:00 to 4:15 for yourself.
Further, if a bump stock had been in use at the time, would have made it impossible for a single shooter to be firing 2 weapons at the same time because bump fire requires both hands to be used at the same time and eliminates the possibility that a single shooter was shooting with one weapon in each hand.
It's very clear and obvious.
It wasn't an echo (echo's repeat exactly what is there). Echo's don't change the number of shots being fired. The video shows two distinct rates of fire and weapons being used.
I don't care what the official explanation is.
Further, there are videos that have been posted by former marines with combat experience that were in the "kill box" that said they have no doubts of two.
Aside from the body cam footage, listen to 4:00 to 4:15 for yourself.
I don't understand how a second shooter could have been in that same room and not been caught on the hotel security cameras escaping.
If there were more than one they must have been elsewhere.
That being said, Sonic transmission over electronic gear is not always free from artifacts. Anyone who has owned a smartphone or even an ordinary telephone will recognize this problem.
And just because it's not practical to coordinate two bump stock guns at the same time doesn't mean the shooter didn't try.
They may also find out that he was filing down sears or adding in bits that made the guns unstable. It's possible he had a runaway condition.
If there were more than one they must have been elsewhere.
That being said, Sonic transmission over electronic gear is not always free from artifacts. Anyone who has owned a smartphone or even an ordinary telephone will recognize this problem.
And just because it's not practical to coordinate two bump stock guns at the same time doesn't mean the shooter didn't try.
They may also find out that he was filing down sears or adding in bits that made the guns unstable. It's possible he had a runaway condition.
Daryll
.270 WIN
Did the security cameras cover the corridor outside the room..??
As it seems there was an hour gap between the final shots being fired, and the police storming the room, a 2nd shooter could have been out of the state before the police went in the room and found "the shooter" dead.... or he could have simply moved down the corridor to his room and posed as just another guest..
Theres a very large gap there when anything could have happened..
As it seems there was an hour gap between the final shots being fired, and the police storming the room, a 2nd shooter could have been out of the state before the police went in the room and found "the shooter" dead.... or he could have simply moved down the corridor to his room and posed as just another guest..
Theres a very large gap there when anything could have happened..
Try as hard as he wanted to caddman, it is mechanically not possible to get a gun bump firing on its' own. You have to use both hands, even with a slidefire stock.
Even with jungle rigged springs, elastic requires physical manipulation to achieve.
Short of a motor and a cam and even at that, we're getting much deeper in the discussion than what I believe happened.
From two different videos that I have heard, there were two different shooters. I can specifically hear two different guns, two different rates of fire, and two different accounts of how many were being fired at once.
As for filing down sears, it may be possible in some instances, however, with the way the AR15 is designed, will normally lock up or even worse, will have an out of battery detonation and catastrophic failure (kaboom--seen here: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/11/20/colt-ar-15-kaboom/ )
Let me explain.
If you filed down a sear, or another and even easier way to defeat the sear that I won't discuss here, causes a condition known as "hammer follow", which means the hammer swings freely upon the movement of the bolt going back and forth. To that, the way that AR15's and AR10's are designed, the bolt has to rotate and lock closed in the barrel extension before the firing pin will physically make contact with the primer and with hammer follow, the hammer is actually riding on the firing pin as it moves and most often, the gun will simply stop firing with a click. Then you would have to clear the stoppage and recharge the weapon and go again. At best, you MAY get a few rounds that fired automatically, at worst, the gun will explode in your hands.
Further, with the timing issue that I noted, would almost have to certainly be tuned with each gun because while the AR tolerances are pretty tight, there are variances. Even minor variances where the fire control group pin placement is could be the difference between a gun that would work illegally as intended, but likely won't without extensive modification to the various parts.
Most people on the internet do not have the mechanical knowledge or ability to correctly convert a gun to fire automatically in the manner that you describe. It would be even more simple to machine and convert one to an illegal machinegun spec than it would to try to jungle rig one up to do that. And like murder and terrorism, there are already laws that prohibit doing that.
A single person cannot bumpfire a rifle and fire another gun or pistol simultaneously. It is simply not physically or mechanically possible.
Interesting video. Seems legit. Curious as to whether it will get picked up and carried furthur by the FBI.
I'm sure the only thing the media will notice is that he is OCing which will instantly negate any facts he has to offer.
I'm sure the only thing the media will notice is that he is OCing which will instantly negate any facts he has to offer.
Daryll
.270 WIN
I think he has the right idea (apart from the "sound of the bullets hitting the sidewalk" bit... as I mentioned earlier, its the crack as bullets pass by, I'm sure some of you Vets know that sound...), but what puzzles me is if both shooters were firing at the same time, and in bursts longer than .5 seconds, how does he know which Crack and Thump to match up to take his timing from..?
I think he used the audio from a single video, rather than polluting it with different sources.
I think he mentioned that the same could be done using multiple videos to triangulate the position, but the fbi would have to question multiple people to find out where the various videos were filmed to triangulate the findings.
I think he mentioned that the same could be done using multiple videos to triangulate the position, but the fbi would have to question multiple people to find out where the various videos were filmed to triangulate the findings.
Daryll
.270 WIN
I'm not sure if you got my meaning John.... even if he used a single video, if there were 2 shooters you would get a mixture of Cracks and Thumps that would be vary hard to sort out...
Even one shooter firing a long burst (over 0.5 seconds) would mix up the cracks and thumps... adding another shooter firing at the same time, maybe at a different distance so the flight time was 0.3 seconds, would just make a complete jumble of sound...
As I said, I think hes on to something, but I'd be interested to know how he isolated the sounds to conclusively say the possible other shooter was 250 yards away.
Even one shooter firing a long burst (over 0.5 seconds) would mix up the cracks and thumps... adding another shooter firing at the same time, maybe at a different distance so the flight time was 0.3 seconds, would just make a complete jumble of sound...
As I said, I think hes on to something, but I'd be interested to know how he isolated the sounds to conclusively say the possible other shooter was 250 yards away.
More info coming out. But this was dug from a lot deeper. My Daddy used to always tell me "son, if you want to find an answer, follow the money".
OK, this probably has nothing to do with anything. But I find it unsettling if nothing else.
Mandalay Bay is one of the biggest money-makers for its owner, casino giant MGM Resorts International.
Also, looks like George Soros invested millions into MGM Resorts International.
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https://www.reviewjournal.com/opini...gms-ceo-risks-angering-many-of-his-customers/
excerpt:
COMMENTARY: MGM’s CEO risks angering many of his customers
In response to what he sees as the racism, bigotry, intolerance and violence in the wake of Charlottesville, Murren announced last week that MGM will match employee contributions to a collection of groups that include extreme leftist organizations and Muslim advocacy outfits.
Not because of his personal views. I don’t care about them. It’s a free country. But no CEO should involve his company in controversial politics, let alone the funding of extreme and radical organizations. Murren has just put MGM in bed with an organization that has ties to Islamic terrorism.
Murren could have announced MGM donations to groups that combat terrorism, or groups that support the families of cops killed in the line of duty or wounded warriors.
Instead he announced donations to extreme leftist groups, some backed by controversial radical Marxist George Soros. The groups include the Southern Poverty Law Center, which conservatives have accused of “character assassination.” The center lists many mainstream conservative organizations as “hate groups.” I’m sure millions of MGM customers support these groups. The center lists Americans who have questioned or criticized radical Islam as being part of “hate groups.” I’m sure millions of MGM customers would be offended by this.
Is this a group MGM’s board or shareholders want to be tied to?
It gets worse. Murren announced that MGM would match employee donations to the Council on American Islamic Relations. This outfit was named by the Justice Department as “an unindicted co-conspirator” to Muslim terrorism. The group has been linked to Hamas. In addition, CAIR advises Muslims not to cooperate with the FBI.
But don’t take my word for it. In 2003, liberal Democrat Sen. Charles Schumer said, “CAIR has ties to terrorism.”
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OK, this probably has nothing to do with anything. But I find it unsettling if nothing else.
Mandalay Bay is one of the biggest money-makers for its owner, casino giant MGM Resorts International.
Also, looks like George Soros invested millions into MGM Resorts International.
-----------------------------------------------------------
https://www.reviewjournal.com/opini...gms-ceo-risks-angering-many-of-his-customers/
excerpt:
COMMENTARY: MGM’s CEO risks angering many of his customers
In response to what he sees as the racism, bigotry, intolerance and violence in the wake of Charlottesville, Murren announced last week that MGM will match employee contributions to a collection of groups that include extreme leftist organizations and Muslim advocacy outfits.
Not because of his personal views. I don’t care about them. It’s a free country. But no CEO should involve his company in controversial politics, let alone the funding of extreme and radical organizations. Murren has just put MGM in bed with an organization that has ties to Islamic terrorism.
Murren could have announced MGM donations to groups that combat terrorism, or groups that support the families of cops killed in the line of duty or wounded warriors.
Instead he announced donations to extreme leftist groups, some backed by controversial radical Marxist George Soros. The groups include the Southern Poverty Law Center, which conservatives have accused of “character assassination.” The center lists many mainstream conservative organizations as “hate groups.” I’m sure millions of MGM customers support these groups. The center lists Americans who have questioned or criticized radical Islam as being part of “hate groups.” I’m sure millions of MGM customers would be offended by this.
Is this a group MGM’s board or shareholders want to be tied to?
It gets worse. Murren announced that MGM would match employee donations to the Council on American Islamic Relations. This outfit was named by the Justice Department as “an unindicted co-conspirator” to Muslim terrorism. The group has been linked to Hamas. In addition, CAIR advises Muslims not to cooperate with the FBI.
But don’t take my word for it. In 2003, liberal Democrat Sen. Charles Schumer said, “CAIR has ties to terrorism.”
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Wouldn't that constitute obstruction of justice during an investigation and land people in jail immediately?
I think as long as one string starts before the other you cojld keep the 1st sep based on cadence making it easier to isolate the 2nd. If they started at the same time it may be more difficult. When you actually look at the sound waves you can pick out things with a lot more granularity then by the naked ear.
I was very interested in the acoustic analysis of the JFK shooting. There was acoustic evidence that put some doubt to the single shooter theory. The whole paper is a pretty rough read. But so was the complete Warren Report and I read both of them. [I worked a lot of midnight shifts.]
http://www.scienceandjusticejournal.com/article/S1355-0306(01)71845-X/pdf
http://www.scienceandjusticejournal.com/article/S1355-0306(01)71845-X/pdf
Because of a degree of uncertainty attached to this detection a second laboratory was asked to review the evidence. Specialists in sonar applications with the Computer Sciences Department of the City University New York concurred that the recording did include the acoustic signature of a gunshot emanating from the Grassy Knoll. In their final reports, both laboratories estimated that the likelihood of the relevant acoustic pattern being a chance array of random radio noises was no more than 5% [6,7]. Their findings were instrumental in the HSCA's conclusion that there probably was a conspiracy behind Kennedy's murder [8].