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590 Not Totally Chambering Shell

D

dull

Copper BB
Hi all,
I have a "new" well-used 590 I just got and am having occasional issues totally feeding my shells. I attached a couple of pics to help illustrate the issue. When I am chambering the shell, it seems to not be seating flush to the bolt-face when the problem occurs, and the shell is being chambered at and angle making it pretty much impossible to chamber.
I am thinking it is possibly the lifter--it almost looks like the shell is getting pinched between the arms and the bottom part of the shell is not seating flush to the bolt like the top. Sometimes, also, the shell doesn't seat in the extractors, with a similar angle.
Any thoughts? I have repeated this issue with several types of shells. Any input would be appreaciated.
 

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So the shell gets wedged in the chamber and it won’t load ?

The bottom picture looks normal just before the chamber forces the shell up into the extractors. The lifter should drop out of the way an 1/8”or so just before the bolt locks up to the chamber.I have tried to cause malfunction and I can’t get a shell to feed wrong as long as it is fully in the receiver and I have tried all angles, upside down. I have put the tip of a shell in the chamber and the brass clean down in the lifter and it always loads. I think if the lifter was pinching the shell enough to make a difference then it wouldn’t slide into place alongside the bolt. I would look at the extractors….hard to tell without the gun in hand and seeing it malfunction…video?

In the first picture is the shell actually clipped into the extractor ? If so that is not normal. Doesn’t need to be in the extractor to load but it does to fully close the bolt
 
Yep, the shell is clipped into the extractors. I go to chamber the shell and it seems normal, then just stops before feeding fully like pictured. I think it is because the shell is almost normally chambered but gets hung up and they clip in before stopping. Possible the barrel would cause a hangup in there angled upwards? Feeling around in the chamber, the barrel seems to be sticking into the chamber area on top a little, creating a little lip. Maybe knock this off some? Thanks.
 
When I get home tonight I will try to simulate your problem and I will also look close at the head space. I am 99% sure that when the shell is clipped into the extractors it should be sucked up to the bolt closer than your top picture is showing. When you cycle the action dry do you notice the lifter dropping out of the way right before the bolt locks up?
 
I'll check tonight on the lifter dropping, but pretty sure it drops ok, no issues getting another round out of the tube. The round is stuck as pictured, need to check if stuck in chamber or on the barrel lip.
 
Thanks for the help thus far....don't know that I am set up for video right now. So a little more after looking at it more closely/playing with it:

The lifter arms appear to be about parallel to the opening when the bolt is halfway forward and then drops a little downwards as the bolt closes home. Before this tipping point, it is angled upwards and am now thinking this may tie into barrel/receiver overlap on the upper part of the barrel. There is a pretty distinctive lip on the top vs. bottom where the two seem to be more blended.
Now I've noticed a few distinct sticking points associated:
1) The shells that are sticking further out are tending to be the Fiocchi's which are larger diameter than most other shot (it wont fall out of chamber under gravity vs. other shells that will), so maybe these tighter tolerances with that slight initial ramp-up of the lifters are getting them stuck.
2) On other shells which have less issues, they tend to clip into the extractors a little low on the bolt face and are tilted a little upwards (the gap on the lower part against the face) and the brass lip is catching on the upper barrel lip.

Main questions from these observations: does that sound about right in terms of the lifter motions and how about the top lip on the barrel. Maybe the front of the lifter is a bit pinched causing this ride up? Thanks for bearing with me.
 
No sweat that’s what these places are supposed to be for. I haven’t had your problem but hopefully we can at least do some trouble shooting

The lifter sounds like its working right to me. The top of the chamber has a distinct lip about the thickness of a nickel or so. I will tell you that once the shell is clipped in the extractors it is super tight on my gun. I just tried to hold the shell as tight as possible while trying to extract the shell from the chamber and I could not get any separation at all between the shell and the face of the bolt....

Have you taken it apart yet?

Realoads or factory loads ?
 
Interesting about the extractors, when the shell is locked in, I can push it around and get some play in all directions.
It doesn't ever seem to want to seat correctly until the shell slides far enough into the chamber to force the base up the bolt face. It seems to be grabbing the shell a little early, low on the bolt face.

All factory ammo, 2 3/4" several different types from buck to bird shot. I have taken it apart to clean, check for burrs etc many, many times now---quickly becoming an expert at breaking this down.
 
dull said:
It doesn't ever seem to want to seat correctly until the shell slides far enough into the chamber to force the base up the bolt face. It seems to be grabbing the shell a little early, low on the bolt face.
Click to expand...
that is normal



If the shell in the first picture is clipped in to the extractor then that is not normal. I might be seeing it wrong but it looks like there is a gap between the bolt and brass….or am I wrong.

These things only have a few things that can go wrong. So far it sounds like the lifter and chamber are normal. I would blame ammo but you addressed that, although you are saying some ammo is better than others and that says extractor to me....hard call. Ideal if you could get another one for comparison and to see how your ammo feeds in another one

And just for clarification I can move the shell vertically up and down the bolt face, more of a roll and not very much, but can’t get any gap. If there is any at all you would have to measure it with calipers
 
If the shell in the first picture is clipped in to the extractor then that is not normal. I might be seeing it wrong but it looks like there is a gap between the bolt and brass….or am I wrong.
Click to expand...

There is a gap there....sometimes the shell base is pressed up under the extractors when cambering, other times it rides in front of them until there is enough pressure from chamber etc. to clip in.....now that I am paying attention to the difference, it seems that when the shell rides in front it is harder to chamber and tends to get stuck more.
 
dull said:
sometimes the shell base is pressed up under the extractors when cambering, other times it rides in front of them until there is enough pressure from chamber etc. to clip in......
Click to expand...
that is normal as well......Sorry I'm not much help and I’m running out of ideas without the gun in hand. Maybe a chamber polishing. Any way to talk to previous owner?

At no time should the shell be hard going in.

If my muzzle is pointed down and I drop a shell through the ejection port, the shell always chambers on its own without the use of the bolt.

Take your worst brand shell for this and just try to drop it in the chamber without cycling the action. If it gets stuck the problem lays either with the shell or the chamber
 
Hi, thanks for the help. I think I fixed the problem (but need to play with it more to make sure). I replaced the lifter and that seems to have been the culprit. When I compared the new to the old, the old was stretched out wider in the rear by the pivots and the front was canted a little. Will have to see if this is all the issue, but seems to cycle a lot smoother now and has cycles a few tubes well......thanks all for the input!
 
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